Viewey Real Estate is a boutique real estate agency founded by brothers Nicholas and Jonathan Viewey. Our passion is connecting people with property they love. We believe our unique contemporary style and quality of service provides a positive real estate experience for today’s modern consumer. We are not influenced by traditional real estate boundaries when it comes to buying, selling, leasing or property management, instead we listen, learn and are always finding new and innovative ways to satisfy our clients needs.
http://viewey.com.au
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You can read an entire transcript of Jonathon’s interview here.
I’m Ingrid Thompson and thank you for reading this post.
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Happy reading! Now here is the full transcript of the podcast.
INGRID: Morning Jonathon.
JONATHON: Morning Ingrid.
INGRID: And thanks so much for joining us. How would you describe your business, I know it’s real estate but what does that mean?
JONATHON: My business is Viewey Real Estate and it’s a partnership between myself and my brother Nicholas. I guess to describe it, it’s a boutique slash independent real estate business in Newtown.
INGRID: Newtown is an inner west suburb of Sydney.
JONATHON: Yes it’s on the city fringe. Yes, inner west but also on the cusp of inner Sydney. It’s a suburb that’s a crossover of both really.
INGRID: And we are sitting in Jonathon’s office and its quite near a train line, so we might hear trains every now and again. We are right in the hub of it.
JONATHON: We well and truly are, so we might hear a train. We are 50 or 100 meters from the train station.
INGRID: So Jonathon, when did you start this business?
JONATHON: We moved into the office and signed the lease on 15 June but Viewey Real Estate the business itself, opened September 2013.
INGRID: So you’ve been in business for a little while?
JONATHON: Yes.
INGRID: Jonathon why did you start your own business? Because you’d been in real estate, so why did you start your own business?
JONATHON: This is probably my 10th year in real estate. I got into real estate straight after school. Something I always wanted to do was open a business but I didn’t know what. I didn’t know what I wanted to do. I grew into real estate as an assistant and I grew out of that role and became an agent in 2012, grew out of that role and became a contractor and that’s when we opened up Viewey Real Estate.
Then we had one or two years and I wanted to do something different. I felt the sales business was fun but there wasn’t a path for growth and it wasn’t an asset we were building. As soon as we went on holidays or stopped working the money stopped. I thought that was fine for my mid to late 20s but then I wanted some stability, an asset. I wanted to build something as well.
INGRID: One of my questions I normally ask is what did you want from the business from day one, so is that what you were looking for?
JONATHON: From day one, I wanted a number of things. I wanted to prove to myself I could do it. That was something I wanted to do – I wanted to step out of my comfort zone. So that was what I wanted out of the business. Two was to build an asset and become financially stable. I felt like with the years in real estate the more money I earnt the more money I spent, and I never really had any property or investments. So from day one I wanted to focus on property management as well.
INGRID: Jonathon, tell me when did it feel like you were in business? When was your business ‘real’?
JONATHON: I think there was a couple of times when I thought I was in business and something would happen and I’d think ok, now I am in business. Its happened probably 2 or 3 times over the last 4 years.
When I moved from an assistant to an agent role, I was always hearing at training seminars that treat, I guess you being an agent, like you are in business. So when I became an agent I came from the mindset that I’m in business and with every person I deal with this is my business and my own brand – but there is only so much you can really feel that way without actually having your own business. Then I think in June 2013 I set out as an agent and I felt like I was in business, but then in 2013 I set up Viewey and became a contractor to the company I was with. Then it really felt like a business because I was invoicing that company for the commission that I was owed and I had to pay my own super, and employees. So in September 2013 was when I started feeling like a business owner. But then moving into an office and rebranding, I felt like a business owner then. Then again probably after 3-6 months later after hiring some staff, and getting some cold callings for the brand, I think that was another step in feeling like a business owner. Then I know that in the next 2-3 years there will be plenty more steps. So it wasn’t really one moment in time, but there were probably 2 or 3 times over the last 4 years I felt I was “in business.”
INGRID: That’s a great answer Jonathon, thanks. So how did you know, you are in an area where there are a number of Real Estate’s, so how did you know there are customers for what you wanted to offer? How did you know there were customers?
JONATHON: Good question. A couple of reasons. When we were another brand we were a big kind of corporate brand and I was always worried about stepping out because I thought some of the business would come from the brand, but then I realised after a few years that they were never about the brand. They would never cold call into the office. Customers always came from meeting us at open homes. I just knew that regardless of what brand we were, they would have brokered us. So long as the brand was clean, respectable and consistent, there was no reason they wouldn’t work with us. So I just knew. We’d win some listings and people would say the only reason they weren’t going with you was the brand that you were with, but we like you as a person, so we are going with you for that reason. So that cemented the decision that we could do this with any brand – so we decided to create our own.
INGRID: Lets create our own, that’s fabulous. So how did you fund the business to start with? So obviously there was the office, and you had to register the name, so there’s funding required there. What sort of things did you have to spend money on – and where did that money come from? How did you make money in the beginning?
JONATHON: Nicholas and I, with the commissions we had earned from the previous company, we aren’t huge spenders so we had some savings there, so we were going to use that. But before we went off and spent too much we sat down and worked out where we should spend the money in our business. And we knew in real estate alot of it is about perception, so when the consumer sees you and look you up on line they look at your website, the properties you sell and the presentation of those. That is where they see you – they don’t walk into your office, they don’t drive past your street, so we spent the money, we started the business with not as much money as you think to open a real estate business. We spent money on the website, we spent money on the branding, and that’s pretty much the majority of where the money went. And everything else, the backend, accounting and other things are ongoing, it was fine, it wasn’t too bad.
INGRID: How do you find new customers? You alluded to the fact that people know you and meet you at open houses and events, and it is that sort of industry isn’t it, where you make an impression? But in what ways would customers find you?
JONATHON: I think it is really changing and its probably changing across the board with all businesses, but its definitely changing with real estate and that’s the business I’m in. I know that years ago the consumer would contact an agent because they are thinking of selling and if you had a big enough brand you’d get a call or you would be one of 3 or 4. Now agents are always chasing people looking at selling and they might not focus on people buying that have nothing to sell. Whereas our business model is that everyone we are in contact with we see as potential business. If they are looking at buying that is just as important as if they are looking at selling.
I think we met you Ingrid when you were thinking of buying a couple of years ago, and it goes from there. If you stay in touch with that person, and if you help enough people get what they want, then you get what you want. Nicholas and I have focussed on that and that is where alot of our business comes from. Just meeting people and generally helping them with what they want, that is how we got our business. We didn’t have the presence or the experience in this area, we haven’t been here 10-15 years to get the callings, so we just focus on every person we are in contact with, sells you as much as we can. It comes back through referral or recommendation.
INGRID: So how do you know what people want? You said you know what people want and you give it to them, but what is your approach to that?
JONATHON: I think sometimes all real estate businesses sound the same, because we are all trained the same way. One of my mentors said to me 3 years ago, if you sound different, people will listen. So I think rather than having the same script as everyone else, or the same generic questions on every phone call they are going to answer the same way and go through it and move on. But if you are generally interested and you take an interest in their story, what they are looking for, where they are coming from, and how your business will help them, and then you get the right answers. And it does come down to qualifying your client. Qualifying whether they can help you, or you can help them, or if the interaction stops there – it’s all about qualifying.
INGRID: Pricing. I guess people believe that real estate has a model, so how did you decide your pricing strategy?
JONATHON: That’s interesting really because I think pricing real estate is really as much as you can get usually ……so let’s start here and see if we can negotiate. Every agent’s fee is negotiable. When Nick and I left the company we were with, we had to give away 40% of our fee just for using their brand, not to mention everything else. So when we went out on our own we thought we could discount 40% and still have the same proper margin but then we thought about that, we didn’t know that was not the way to do it. Because that lowers all our competitors’ fees as well and it’s not good for the market, so we are not going to do that. We will hold firm on our fee because if anything I think our service offering is more tailored and more personal then what we offered before. So we kept our fee firmly where it was at, and we are very transparent with our fees.
Alot of agents try to dodge the fee question so when we are asked, I give them a range, or a flat fee and a sliding scale and let them choose. The flat fee is very competitive and I’ll say ‘rather than just selecting the agent on the fee, why don‘t you do a sliding fee? A conservative rate that you feel is reasonable for a sale price and if we get beyond that it’s this figure, and make us work for our fee.’ I give them options, so rather than a guessing game, I give them a few options and then the client can choose.
INGRID: Very nice, thank you. Now, exit strategy. Lots of people don’t think about the exit strategy. You are young and only a couple of years in business, but do you have an exit strategy? You can tell us as much or as little about that as you like.
JONATHON: Yes, I definitely do. I think it really depends on when I stop enjoying what I’m doing. I really enjoy it now and I think I will for the next 5 to 10 years. But in the meantime I want to build the business up to the point where you know we are in the top 3 agencies in the area, and if I can get to that point I know my competitors will want us to leave. So if I can build our asset as big as we can possibly get it, if I can recruit and build the team to a point where we are a dominant presence in our area, I know that some of the bigger corporate brands that have endless budgets would love to buy us out. And I know they will probably pay for what we’ve got to either see us move on or join their business under their brand. So for me it’s just head down and grow the business as much as we can.
I feel like there is always going to be a demand for a good quality rent roll in the area and to have good staff on board, so if there’s a business out there that, you know, when I get to the point that I want to do something different with my life, I’ve got the asset there, and I’ve got a good team that has worked with me. And potentially if the team is happy, I want to do it the right way. I had lunch with a friend of mine the other day and he was working in a business where it was sold without him being informed at all. He was very close and he felt a bit betrayed by that. And for me it’s a long way away, but when I do it, I want to do it properly and keep the team informed of what is going on. Yeah there is an exit strategy there, but I guess building the asset as big as we can get it, just playing good business, and then moving on.
INGRID: And just wait for somebody to buy you? (laughs)
JONATHON: Yeah. (laughs)
INGRID: You used an expression there that perhaps some of our listeners might not be familiar with because real estate people just see the ‘for sale’ sign and you mentioned something there – a rent roll. Could you talk a little bit more about how that fits into growing the asset?
JONATHON: Sure. So a rent roll is basically a portfolio of properties that you manage on behalf of your clients. It’s basically rental properties. So there is the sales side of things where people see the large commission cheques and the real estate agents driving around selling properties which is all great fun. But as soon as that stops the money stops – so as soon as you go to sell the business that’s worth nothing. What is worth money is the rent roll. And why it is worth money is because its consistent income coming into the business, and if you build that up, 50, 100, or 200…. some of the bigger agencies, and the biggest ones in the area are about 1500. So once you have a rent roll about that big it gives your business some weight. It gives you consistent income so you can take more risks, and employ more people. But the asset in that is, I guess, it’s basically you can sell that asset to another competitor. And you build that asset organically.
Its built from service, so once someone gives you their property to manage, there is work involved and there is consistent work involved and that’s why we have property managers. It’s an asset built from zero and its always there so that’s exciting to me. In 2 or 3 years time, yes, we’ve had 2 or 3 years in sales and that’s been good, before we opened the business, but as soon as you step away from that you have nothing else besides….so if you are smart to invest in other things, which Nick and I didn’t, so I think now that we’ve got this, we are building a rent roll and its really exciting.
INGRID: Hmmm, and are there a lot of systems and processes built in, to take care of those rental properties?
JONATHON: There is, but I think once you sit down and really think it through, and you get the right people on board and the right processes, templates and systems. There are some things out there that help you manage everything. And once you get the day to day upkeep and work sorted, it’s not that hard. Its common sense, customer service and having the right systems.
INGRID: Yes, customer service wins out every time. So let’s do some reflective questions. What’s one thing that you really wish you’d done differently? Somewhere along the line. So you’ve left the other organisation and you are on your own, as you look back what is something you wish you’d done differently?
JONATHON: I’d probably, hmm, it’s tricky because …I could say work a bit harder. I feel like we have worked fairly hard but there is always room to work a little bit harder. I think maybe we need to enjoy and celebrate every win. Remember to enjoy the journey because you always feel like you could be doing more. We’ve had our first year now and I think we should sit back and enjoy the first year that we’ve had. So I think celebrating a win, that’s a good thing to do, not excessively, but sitting back and reflecting and being grateful for the people giving you the opportunity to work for them.
Maybe recruiting people a little bit sooner rather than later, push myself a little bit more. I think we started a bit conservative because we’d never done it before so we weren’t 100% sure we’d have the cash flow to be able to recruit straight away, so maybe do that a bit sooner. But they are probably the two things, maybe recruit a little bit sooner and find the right people.
INGRID: Hmm, cause what would that have given you if you had somebody on board earlier? What difference would that have made?
JONATHON: I think it would have freed me up to be more dollar productive. And say if we’d bought a junior on board from day one, a year on they’d be at a point where they would be dollar productive for your business as well, instead of just starting out. But also I think bringing in a sales person once they start performing in the market would see that, that’s the nature of our business and the ball would start rolling and more people would come on board. So doing that from day one would have been great but other than that, there isn’t too much else I’d really change.
INGRID: That’s a great answer. So this is a slightly different question – what do you think you should have known, if somebody could have told you something? You’ve had great mentors so you’ve probably had some really good information along the way, but if there is anything that somebody could have told you that might have made a difference – and what might that be?
JONATHON: Before or during the business, or a bit of both?
INGRID: Either. Do you ever feel as though you’d thought, I wish I’d known that?
JONATHON: Yes all the time, all the time. (laughs) There are lots of little things but nothing that’s really changed the course of the business. I think I learnt from those little things anyway, so maybe I need to go through that. But if I go back, if I wish I’d known, what would that be? I can’t think of it right now, but maybe it’s the little mistakes. As long as they aren’t affecting too many other people you learn from them and you try not to do them again. I don’t think there was anything else big I wish I knew. But you mentioned I have a few mentors I’m in constant contact with. I have another friend who is at the same level of me, both the same age, both opened a business within 3-6months of each other, and we train at the gym every day, so its great I get to bounce ideas off him. And I think teaching, like I’ve got another friend of mine who is probably a year behind where I am at the moment, and explaining to him what he’s got to do to get to that next level, so it really confirms what I should be doing.
INGRID: Hmmm. Yes.
JONATHON: So I think it’s a bit of both ways. Learning from someone and also teaching someone helps a lot.
INGRID: That’s a really valuable answer Jonathon thank you. I hope people listening can take from that, because we learn what we teach and that is very insightful. So you’ve mentioned mentors and you don’t need to mention their names, but my question is who, apart from yourself, has been of greatest assistance? You work with Nicholas, you have some mentors, are there other people who have been important to you?
JONATHON: Yes there really is, there really is. And for different reasons, there are people in the same business that are competitors that really help me, these people that I used to work for. My brother has helped us a lot. And there are people like my mum. She bought me up by herself the whole way though and she still helps out so much. And these days my accountant and my financial advisor. He does so much more than just our accounts. His background is risk assessment. So anytime I want to do something silly he’s the first one to say no, which is great. (laughs) Its good to have someone there like that. Nick and I love taking risks and he’s the complete opposite, which is great. Mentors, competitors, friends, family and sometimes clients. People that you work for.
INGRID: So having a team of people around you to support you is important?
JONATHON: Yes and sometimes you can get caught up with yourself and building your business and you don’t realise the support that you’ve got that’s there, because it’s not shown in a specific way. Like with a business mentor they help you specifically on that. But say mum, sometimes I forget how much she really does help us. Or my friends in different ways. I think they are just as big a support as the others. And it’s good to be grateful for that.
INGRID: Who can give you good feedback? You’ve probably mentioned some of them already. (laughs) But you know, if you get a bit caught up with yourself, who can give you good feedback that you can take on board?
JONATHON: That’s a tricky question because when you do something great you get positive feedback but when you do something not so great, or you can improve on, there’s not that many people who can tell you ‘I would do that differently’. I think Nick is a good one, and vice versa. If I’m doing something or say something on the phone, or do something a specific way, and he doesn’t agree with it, he usually speaks up. And same from me to him. But other than that it is tricky to have someone to remind you to do it the right way, because they are there to praise you but not so much to give you constructive criticism in front of you. So I think that people who know you the best are the ones that are there to say, you know….
INGRID: Yes, and having you and Nick work so closely together is invaluable for that. Because you trust someone like that to give you the positive and the constructive.
JONATHON: Definitely working with Nicholas, I couldn’t think of a better business partner. We take it for granted because we don’t think about it, like I can go on holidays and not worry about things, and I can leave things in his hands and he can make a decision. He can spend money without getting my approval. If anyone wanted to do something silly, we can just watch out each other. It’s great.
INGRID: Yes that’s great. Ok, so what would you recommend to someone else who was starting a business? And you did mention earlier that you observed that there seemed to be more people starting businesses. What would you say to someone thinking about starting a business?
JONATHON: Funny a friend of mine actually resigned a week ago and he’s about to start his own agency in a completely different area in a week or two, and I’ve been helping him set that up over the last couple of months. I think the biggest thing is backing yourself. And having self-belief and really going for it and understanding that there is always something to lose but at the same time, not doing it is losing a bit more, if that’s what you really want to do. Understanding the reasons why you want to do it, but I think the biggest thing is self- belief and really backing yourself.
INGRID: Thank you. What are the 3 characteristics that you have that make you successful in business? What is it about you that makes you a successful business person, successful in real estate.
JONATHON: That’s a tricky question – if you asked a few other people they might give you answers different to me answering it myself. I’d probably say I think that word again- self-belief. I really believe in what we are doing and I feel like a service …I feel like we do offer a good service. And I believe in it, I believe in myself. I’d like to think I’m probably personable compared to the standard agent. But people meet me and they meet 2 or 3 or 4 other agents in the same day. I like to put a bit of effort in and understand them, and give them at least a few seconds when I meet them. I know it sounds minimal but it does go along way.
I think just being personable and also having a hunger and a purpose in doing what you are doing. You can’t really have a successful business if you aren’t there to drive it. You can employ all the greatest people but if you are not there to really drive it and be involved and be hungry and fast and outwork your competitors, then what is the point? So I think those 3 things, work ethic, being personable and self-belief.
INGRID: Lovely. And is that what you think other people need as well? Like this friend of yours that’s starting a business. Are these the key characteristics that you think other people need?
JONATHON: Yes I think it’s a bit of everything. Yeah, it really is, you’ve got to be likeable – that is important. Actually plenty of people can be liked in different ways – some people are charismatic, some people are caring, there are different ways of being liked. There is also work ethic, I don’t necessarily think there is any substitution for work ethic. You’ve really got to work hard. I feel like it’s a big wheel. You’ve really got to work very hard but once you have the momentum you can keep it going. But to get it going you have to work very hard. I think the more you believe yourself and back yourself the more people believe in you too. So it goes both ways. So you must have the self-belief because if you don’t, your consumers won’t. It goes hand in hand. These things are very important to help your business as well.
INGRID: Thanks so much for your time Jonathon. Is there anything else I haven’t covered about you or your business experience that you’d like to add to finish?
JONATHON: I think that’s pretty much everything. It’s also very important to have a plan and set some goals. I know everyone talks about goals and all that, but I think it’s very important to have a bit of a structure and a plan, whether it be 3 months, 6 months, every quarter, and 12 months, you should have a plan to monitor. And change it if you aren’t hitting your goals every quarter, and just lower them if you need to. Otherwise it starts getting demotivating. Also if you are doing well above what you are expecting, then increase them a bit. Don’t just sit back, push a bit harder. I think knowing your business, knowing the numbers of your business, and working out whether it’s a profitable business or not. It depends on your motivation with the business but if it’s not building an asset or making money, then you might have to change it up a little bit.
INGRID: Well (laughs) then it’s not really a business then, is it?
JONATHON: Yeah (laughs). So then what is the point? It’s important to set goals both business and personal, and just monitor them.
INGRID: Lovely and thanks for your time today.
JONATHON: No worries. Thank you
INGRID: Thank you.